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| Quote Jonesy="Jonesy"I was going to move on because I cant be ars*d trolling through threads and proving points usually but...with two posters I feel are full of CRAP I will make an exception,'"
You can't be *rsed trolling? Doesn't appear that way!
Quote Jonesy="Jonesy"One bad crowd says it all?
You cherry pick one crowd to make your point?'"
No, you cherry picked one crowd to make a point. I'm using your method of argument on yourself to prove that you don't have a point.
You said "What was the final crowd? 31k pretty sad all round for a country that aspires to be a player at Test level."
So who's cherry picking? You picked the 4N Final, I picked the 3N Final. I'm picking the same cherries you're picking and showing your comments up for what they are.
Quote Jonesy="Jonesy"Go back over the numbers across the board and make a point?
How does England and France go for numbers? =#FF4000Not too far off the RL semi-final between Aus and Fiji (a much bigger game).
How did the All Golds tour go?=#FF4000Averaged about 20k.
How did the Kiwi tour go where England finally won a series a couple of years ago.=#FF4000Didn't you just ask that above? And it was GB, not England.
The last World Cup in Great Britain nearly bankrupted the game there it was so well planned and attended.=#FF4000Now who's cherry picking?
 And the final (not featuring any home nation) still nearly got as much as the one in your own country.'"
Last years 4 Nations which is the current stats says England had an average of 16,500 per match.
Eng v France 11K
Eng v Oz 23k
Eng v Kiwis 19k
Final Eng v Oz 31k
So England average 21k in their games all at home. =#FF4000Yes, didn't I just say that?'"
Poor effort.
Quote Jonesy="Jonesy"You quote a game from 4 years ago with 27.5 K as a comparison?=#FF4000You just quoted a tournament from 10 years ago for comparison...
Maybe If it was the "Big Two" it may have been different but England/GB have not made the final in Oz since the concept was started.=#FF0000Hang on, you've just being dissing England/GB. Now they're in the "Big Two"? Make your mind up! And FYI, that final was only 1k more than the final the year before featuring the same two teams in... England! If it wasn't for Brisbane, Australia's international crowds would be just the same as that of England.
You heard of Apples and Apples comparisons?
You compare World cup averages with little Island teams involved with 4 nations averages, it shows you up Mate.=#FF0000Have you not seen your argument? "31k pretty sad"
'"
Quote Jonesy="Jonesy"While we are at it, My response was to the Cherry picking of Test players by Oz and another poster said "like England is doing to Oz"
HARDLY..
I did say I was not sure about the last Test games of the players I mentioned.
Craig Fitzgibbon was not current as he was not selected for the Anzac Test match before he signed with Hull and he was a journeyman that was recalled for a couple of games at the back end of his solid Club career.
Berrigan as you point out was current but at the tail end of his rep career and was offered a longer and much larger financial deal to move to Hull. When you are nearly 30 and get offered a Kings ransom over a long contract, cant blame him.
Matt King was a current Test Winger, he is the best example of a player moving at the top of his game, at the end of the day he is a Winger not a Halfback or Hooker or a key player, he struggled big time for a long while when he did not get the Storm service he was used to.
There are several articles where King says he was being paid "mad money" to go to Warrington, more than the best player in the NRL was getting at the time.
Cherry Picking?'"
Remind me, how many of England's current test team have the Aussies "cherry picked" over the last few years?
Gareth Ellis. Sam Burgess. Err... anyone else?
Richie Mathers?
Chris Thorman?
Yes. It's just SL clubs that pick up dud foreigners.
Quote Jonesy="Jonesy"Just a thought, has Hull looked at Luke Burt, Nathan Cayless or Nathan Hindmarsh? two of those were recent Test players, Could they be lured to the Club with the Master Coach and the best fans in the game?
Now thats Cherry picking.
Eric Grothe Jnr will be bundled in for free.
Cheers'"
Hull don't have any quota spaces left, so if they have been looking, I don't have a clue how they'd be able to sign them.
Come back when you've got a point that hasn't been contradicted too much
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| Quote Jonesy="Jonesy"The Toughest games in the Sport are State of Origin, acknowledged by pretty well everyone.'"
Oh yea its been so tough for Queensland these last 5 years hasnt it. How about we stop the Origin series because right now its hard to see when NSW will win a series.
How the hell are we going to grow international RL if we dont continue and hopefully expand these kinds of tournaments? Do some just not want an International game or something? |
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| Quote Bondi_Warrior="Bondi_Warrior"Oh yea its been so tough for Queensland these last 5 years hasnt it. How about we stop the Origin series because right now its hard to see when NSW will win a series.'"
Exactly.
Last 5 State of Origin series results:
QLD wins - 11 (5 series wins)
NSW wins - 4 (0 series wins)
Last 5 Aus/NZ major tournament results:
Aus wins - 4 + 1 by GP (2 series wins)
NZ wins - 3 (2 series wins including World Champions)
Draws - 1
Even if you include the heavily Australian-biased ANZAC test (basically a meaningless friendly held every year in Australia, and (since the SL War) the only year it wasn't held in Aus it was won by NZ) it still stacks up closer.
Last three Aus/NZ finals - NZ 2 - 1* Aus (*which was a draw after 80mins).
Think these Aussies need to realise that their little inter-state rivalry isn't as big a contest as they think it is. The Kiwis would smash both of them. |
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| Quote Wellsy13="Wellsy13"
Think these Aussies need to realise that their little inter-state rivalry isn't as big a contest as they think it is. The Kiwis would smash both of them.'"
I agree.
Hull v Hull is probably bigger.
<s> |
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| Quote Barry_McKenzie="Barry_McKenzie"I agree.
Hull v Hull is probably bigger.
<s>'"
Your comebacks are getting worse by the day... |
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| Quote Barry_McKenzie="Barry_McKenzie"
This is a Pommie forum.'"
Last time I looked, Prisoner of Mother of England = POME............but hey, you Australians Know best. |
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SHould the 4 Nations be scrapped? No next question please.
So reading through this thread, would the question be because of Cronulla not winning a premiership since 1967 should they be kicked out of the NRL?
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| Quote Ant80="Ant80"SHould the 4 Nations be scrapped? No next question please.
So reading through this thread, would the question be because of Cronulla not winning a premiership since 1967 should they be kicked out of the NRL?'"
yes Cronulla should be dumped to NSW cup where they belong. next question. |
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| Quote roughyedspud="roughyedspud"australia have already confirmed they are'nt playing any tests after the 2012 season'"
We did play NZ in October 2007 in Wellington. I hope we play them at home and away in October 2012, to complete a 3 test series.
Quote roughyedspudforming a GB team would be pointless...12months before a world cup,where we compete as england,scotland & wales,we should be building the hype of england,scotland & wales.....not 17 englishmen playing as GB..'"
Firstly, England should already have built up the hype over three years of 4Ns & June test. English fans already know the team exists. RL people already know a World Cup will be held in 2013. There'll be a June test in 2012 and 2013 to help build hype anyway. Secondly, as for building the hype of Scotland, Wales and Ireland - how will an England series do that? it won't! How will a GB tour negatively affect the Celts? It won't. The Celts will only get a repeat of this year's European Championship, 3 games, regardless of whether England or GB toured.
A Kangaroo test series against GB in the UK in 2011 would have been great, say with a tour game against the Super League Champions, maybe against the Challenge Cup winning club as well. As it stands, a Great Britain tour of NZ would work well. I'd see the following games working:
13th October: European Cup Week 1, Roses Origin Game 1
20th October: European Cup Week 2, Roses Origin Game 2, Trans Tasman Test 2
27th October: European Cup Week 3, Trans Tasman Test 3 (England players fly to Southern Hemisphere, get a week off)
31st October: Warriors vs GB - Mt Smart, Auckland (mid-week, Wednesday night)
3rd November: NZ Maori vs GB - Rotorua/Hamilton/Whangarei
10th November: NZ-GB 1st test - Christchurch/Dunedin
17th November: NZ-GB 2nd test - Wellington
24th November: NZ-GB 3rd test - Eden Park, Auckland |
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GB won't be touring so all that was a waste of time mate......looks good though...we could give it a crack in 2025
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| Quote Wellsy13="Wellsy13"I don't like the idea of clubs vs international sides. If a club from SL wants to take on an Aussie side, it should be an NRL side in an extended WCC, not a friendly.
You're talking about how the union lot have a better international recognition, yet you want to reduce the number of international games our rep sides play in?'"
An international side versus a club team on tour would be much more appealing to a lot of people than the WCC. I used to watch the WCC with excitement, but ultimately, it doesn't mean very much to most Australians. An expanded WCC certainly would not. Also, it would undermine the finals series and Grand Finals of both nations - unless it was run roughly like soccer's WCC, which uses the champions only from each country. We'd need to add the Catalans, Crusaders and Warriors just to fill out numbers, and if those teams hadn't performed well in NRL/SL, it could undermine the concept.
Rugby Union successfully stages Lions tours, where the Lions play midweek tour games against clubs in front of good crowds. The Wallabies, All Blacks and Springboks have all played tour games in recent years against British or Irish clubs, in front of excellent crowds. The Wallabies played and defeated:
* [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4QlYsPdykYGloucester 17-5 at Kingsholm Ground Crowd; 16,500 (capacity)[/url. Tuesday November 3rd, 2009.
* [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7LvrlbvMwUCardiff Blues 31-3 at Cardiff City Soccer Stadium. Crowd 14,622 (capacity is 26,82icon_cool.gif[/url. Tuesday November 24, 2009. This year, the Wallabies will play Irish provincial team Munster and English Premiers Leicester Tigers.
South Africa payed and lost to
* Leicester Tigers at a sold-out Welford Road Stadium, crowd 24,000. [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOIZ9EZO2N0Leicester won 22-17[/url (the video shows how passionate the Leicester club fans during the game and when they won). Friday November 6th, 2009.
* Saracens at Wembley, crowd 46,281 (capacity 90,000). [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldOKPaLnQJw&feature=relatedSaracens won 24-23[/url (the other video doesn't have the crowd noise, but features a performance review by Andy Farrell, ironically)
New Zealand's All Blacks played Munster to a capacity 26,500 crowd at a redeveloped Thomond Park, Tuesday November 18, the mid week ABs winning narrowly. Tell me the electric atmosphere of this game wouldn't be good for RL:
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8hzfrTPo6E&feature=relatedMunster vs All Blacks - Electric Atmosphere, Hakas and Tries[/url |
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union players have the energy to play tour games against club sides because they spend 80% of the game laying on the ground...
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| Quote The Observer="The Observer"An international side versus a club team on tour would be much more appealing to a lot of people than the WCC. I used to watch the WCC with excitement, but ultimately, it doesn't mean very much to most Australians. An expanded WCC certainly would not. Also, it would undermine the finals series and Grand Finals of both nations - unless it was run roughly like soccer's WCC, which uses the champions only from each country. We'd need to add the Catalans, Crusaders and Warriors just to fill out numbers, and if those teams hadn't performed well in NRL/SL, it could undermine the concept.
Rugby Union successfully stages Lions tours, where the Lions play midweek tour games against clubs in front of good crowds. The Wallabies, All Blacks and Springboks have all played tour games in recent years against British or Irish clubs, in front of excellent crowds. The Wallabies played and defeated:
* [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e4QlYsPdykYGloucester 17-5 at Kingsholm Ground Crowd; 16,500 (capacity)[/url. Tuesday November 3rd, 2009.
* [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7LvrlbvMwUCardiff Blues 31-3 at Cardiff City Soccer Stadium. Crowd 14,622 (capacity is 26,82icon_cool.gif[/url. Tuesday November 24, 2009. This year, the Wallabies will play Irish provincial team Munster and English Premiers Leicester Tigers.
South Africa payed and lost to
* Leicester Tigers at a sold-out Welford Road Stadium, crowd 24,000. [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOIZ9EZO2N0Leicester won 22-17[/url (the video shows how passionate the Leicester club fans during the game and when they won). Friday November 6th, 2009.
* Saracens at Wembley, crowd 46,281 (capacity 90,000). [url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ldOKPaLnQJw&feature=relatedSaracens won 24-23[/url (the other video doesn't have the crowd noise, but features a performance review by Andy Farrell, ironically)
New Zealand's All Blacks played Munster to a capacity 26,500 crowd at a redeveloped Thomond Park, Tuesday November 18, the mid week ABs winning narrowly. Tell me the electric atmosphere of this game wouldn't be good for RL:
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D8hzfrTPo6E&feature=relatedMunster vs All Blacks - Electric Atmosphere, Hakas and Tries[/url'"
A few of the Manly guy's that went on the 2009 WCC tour absolutley loved it, conversing with the locals in Leeds.It's up to the Australiasian club's to make a big deal out off it like Manly and the Roosters did.
From memory 40 Manly fans went over there to the UK and the next one I'd think will get close to 100. I'm hoping to be 1 of them |
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| Quote The Observer="The Observer".
Firstly, England should already have built up the hype over three years of 4Ns & June test. English fans already know the team exists. RL people already know a World Cup will be held in 2013. There'll be a June test in 2012 and 2013 to help build hype anyway. '"
what does 17 englishmen,in GB shirts, beating NZ in a 3 game series,do to build up the hype for the 2013 world cup??....england beating NZ on the other hand lays down a marker...GB has no relavence in the current international league structure...
Quote The Observer="The Observer".Secondly, as for building the hype of Scotland, Wales and Ireland - how will an England series do that? it won't! How will a GB tour negatively affect the Celts? It won't. The Celts will only get a repeat of this year's European Championship, 3 games, regardless of whether England or GB toured.
'"
firstly...take ireland off that list...they want nothing to do with GB
secondly....in the unlikey senario that wales or scotland produce a talent good enough to displace 1 of the 17 englishmen that would make up a GB team in the next couple of years,then this lad will be wrenched from the welsh or scottish sides while these side are trying to develop their own sides..
GB will only be worth bringing back when the welsh and scottish start producing players good enough to warrant GB selection....like i keep saying...if theres 17 englishmen on the field...play as england cos thats what they are.. |
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And the final (not featuring any home nation) still nearly got as much as the one in your own country.
