Agree rising costs and wages not or dropping, when a game is on TV you can't blame people for not attending games that come at extra cost

Which crowds are falling? Is the SL average up or down this season? Playoff and Challenge Cup crowds have been an issue for years and they have been worse than this year in the Summer era. I think you're conflating your own indifference or even the present short-term indifference of Leeds fans with the wider picture. The fact of the matter is the game is in robust health - nothing is perfect, but it is stable, reliable and is secure for the future.



And I'll repeat the point I made to the Pie Eater - what is the point of seeking to tear down our sport by making deliberately negative comparisons with another one which faces few if any of the same challenges and shares few if any of the same defining social characteristics? If you continue to view Rugby League in this way it will forever be self-defined into perpetual failure. You are setting an impossible, unreasonable challenge, but one which gives you free scope to forever abuse the sport for its so-called failures. If you judge Rugby League "success" on its own merits, in relation to its own history, its past failings and its past successes I believe you would come to very different conclusions.

Leeds crowds are falling

Looked more than 9k in the ground today yesterday given the amount of Hull fans in the Western Terrace. That said, the Southstand wasn't that packed.

Its down, quite significantly [urlhttp://www.slstats.org/Attendances/[/url (see bottom two lines)







I think you'll find that most RU clubs face the same challenges of getting people to pay to come through the gates and the "defining social characteristics" is a nonsense phrase which is meaningless in the professional era, if you think that all RU crowds are public schoolboys let out on daddys allowance then, frankly, you're wrong.



My comparison was of the current RU World Cup and the forthcoming RL international series and the promotional prospects of both, even a fool would admit that one is cashing in on the opportunity while the other (on past history) will not.

I think it helps that the rights to the games have gone to a terrestrial broadcaster, and have been that way for the sport for many years. They have built up an anticipation about a game of rugby, even though IMO the product is pretty poor. The sport does a great job at promoting the product, wheras League have a great product, but don't seem to be able to generate any interest in the international game.

Thats all perfectly true.



It also helps greatly that they have a viable international product to sell to the broadcasters.

I'm fairly sure those figures are significantly incorrect; by my calculations the average is slightly up - again (by about 2% ignoring the Magic Weekend).



Yes but when has RL EVER been in the same league as RU internationally? It never will and no level of wishful thinking is going to change that. Will RL make its international series successful in its own right? I don't yet know but if the only way to measure it is by comparing it to another, much bigger and more media dominant sport then it is an impossible ask. Completely ignoring RL's historical and still to large degree current position as a niche and largely regional sport is irrational.

I don't ignore the Magic Weekend when compiling my own figures but I do take the daily official gate and divide it equally between the number of games played that day and use those figure within SL aggregate and average calculations.



2011 - SL Reg Rds (Aggregate 1,684,652) Average 8,914 (Increase of 2.8%)



While the aggregate attendance for the sport has increased by 45,828 over 2010, Bradford's own aggregate increased by 72,855 over the same period so it's fairly clear to see where the bounce originated (but you also have to offset the hopefully temporary decrease experienced by St Helens of 43,491.)



=#0000BFGainers: Home SL Reg Rds

Bradford 67% (Cheap Season Ticket Scheme)

Les Catalans 23%

Salford 14% (Last game at the Willows must have helped)

Wakefield 9%

Castleford 8%

Warrington 6%

Wigan 3%

Hull KR 1%



=#FF0000Losers: Home SL Reg Rds

St Helens -30%

Crusaders -27%

Hull -12%

Harlequins -7%

Huddersfield -4%

Leeds -2%

I'm surprised that ours have only gone down by 2%.

I expect that trend to continue unless we pick up good wins early on by playing attractive rugby.

Saints will definitely bounce back next year, Bradford's will plummet.

It will be interesting to see how Salford fare, I expect the away fans numbers to rise due to the novelty value.

Widnes should attract more than the Crusaders.

Wakey will be a major concern I think, but they will be better marketed. Let's hope the fans respond.

Quote Old Feller="Old Feller"Bradford's will plummet.'" Not necessarily.... www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/s ... ge_scheme/ Leeds also get the Easter Thursday game next season which might be slightly beneficial to us.

Quote Old Feller="Old Feller"Bradford's will plummet.'" Not necessarily.... www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/s ... ge_scheme/ Leeds also get the Easter Thursday game next season which might be slightly beneficial to us.

No, I think you're setting the desperado standard Odsal-wide.